DeepSeek-v4.1-Flash-1017

(huggingface.co)

146 points | by theykk 1 hour ago

16 comments

  • pmxi 1 hour ago
    Hilarious sentence: "DeepSeek-V4.1-Flash-1017 is a minor update to DeepSeek-V4.1-Flash, delivering substantial improvements across reasoning, coding, agentic tasks, and visual benchmarks." (emphasis mine)
    • freakynit 1 hour ago
      Kinda shows their team is more engineers than marketers.
    • cardboard9926 32 minutes ago
      Hoping it's minor relative to what's coming
    • jaynetics 1 hour ago
      It's not really contradictory, minor changes can have major effects.
      • mdp2021 48 minutes ago
        So they meant a "small" update - "conservative", "inexpensive"...
    • vrganj 19 minutes ago
      It's about playing to two different audiences.

      The CCP requires extensive certification for new major releases, to make sure a model doesn't do anything they don't want it to.

      To get around this, Chinese labs only bump versions when they have to and claim it's a minor update.

      Then on the other side, they're obviously trying to market to tech crowd...

    • surgical_fire 12 minutes ago
      It's a bit refreshing to read updates from an AI lab without bullshit doomerism and overwhelming sense of self-importance from shit like OpenAI and Claude.

      Also, DS is an excellent model.

    • ReptileMan 55 minutes ago
      That is how exponential functions work. Improve every aspect of a system with 1% and you may get easily 50% more performance.
  • ytxm 51 minutes ago
    It passed my threshold for not caring to try new models back with DS4, I use it for literally everything. Announcements of new models in the series always feel curious, because it doesn't really feel like there's much left to fix that would improve on what's already there for any task I know of.

    It's a bit like obsessing over patch releases of some software after a major upgrade already solved the original problem long ago.

    • xiphias2 42 minutes ago
      I have quite the opposite experience: I can do any concrete coding change with any model, but the intelligence limit just doesn't go through more complex debugging examples.

      And then when I try a smart model, like Astra medium and it solves it (I had a firmware bug in my new laptop where I couldn't charge through USB-C) on the first try (altough with a repo already having lots of information about the hardware/firmware/debugging programs/traces), I realize how much time I'm losing on the few examples that the less intelligent models are just not able to debug and solve.

      • KronisLV 29 minutes ago
        Also they can work in completely new domains, like Astra and Opus 5.5 starting to be able to use something like Blender. Currently they still often do horrible topology and basic UV mistakes, and the animations are really bad, but who knows where they’ll be in 5 years.
    • pimeys 28 minutes ago
      Speed and price. You should try the 4.1 Flash on one of the fast providers. It's pretty crazy how fast this model works, and it's great for iterative software development because you can steer it fast to where you want to go.

      https://www.lithosai.com/

      https://www.coralbricks.ai/

      • swiftcoder 21 minutes ago
        How are these high-speed providers close to matching the API rates from deepseek?
        • pimeys 18 minutes ago
          Seems that V4.1 Flash is quite cheap to serve. Especially how it implements the cache, meaning the cache pricing can be very low depending on how you implement it in your inference engine.

          Depends on your use case. But if you do software development with a harness such as oh-my-pi, your cache rates are probably somewhere above 98%. Coralbricks has free cache reads, meaning it's much cheaper than the Deepseek API rates.

          Lithosai is more expensive especially in the ultra tier. It's if you want extremely snappy and fast responses, which is important e.g. for a personal assistant where every second counts.

          If you generate a lot of output, you're better off with the Deepseek API rates.

      • andrepd 11 minutes ago
        Where does one even get decent ZDR provider? I'm wary of sending sensitive data but not at a scale where I would build my own machine.
    • mdp2021 36 minutes ago
      > improve on what's already there for any task I know of

      What about "good governance"?

      Does it have zero hallucinations? Does it reflect thoroughly on every single idea it uses, verifying its solidity?

    • mmoustafa 49 minutes ago
      definitely could use less thinking time and lower token usage, which is what this bump is focused on
  • jononor 1 hour ago
    Above GLM 5.3, nice! That is a very capable model. I do wish that we will see some smaller "flash" models again though - running this one locally is tough (very costly).
    • LaurensBER 1 hour ago
      For comparison, close to Opus 5. Far behind Sol 6.1 and Opus 5.5.

      Probably a pretty decent model for 90% of the usecases!

      I've been doing a lot of hobby work with GLM 5.3 Flash and I can count the amount of times that I need a stronger model on two hands.

      I have access to unlimited tokens at works and Opus is great but also often overkill if you know exactly what you need.

      • egeozcan 1 hour ago
        I use Opus for planning, through API on medium thinking, it doesn't cost anything significant and the rest can be happily done with deepseek or glm flash. Using sol 6.1 for review loops at the end. All running on pi.

        A very complex task tends to cost like 10$ max. It's comparable to a subscription with enormous flexibility.

        It's a steal.

    • Pragmata 1 hour ago
      Cant you run it on a pair of DGX spark? Sure it's expensive now, but at the initial retail price that was what, 8k in hardware? Not exactly unachievable
      • bashtoni 54 minutes ago
        No, this is not a small model. I believe 4x Sparks is possible but 4.1 is pretty big for a flash model.

        MiMo 2.6 Flash is the most capable model you can currently run on 2x Sparks without resorting to a quantised version of something.

        • Pragmata 51 minutes ago
          I meant quantized. You can get an EXL3 quantized version thats almost the same performance.
  • waximabbax 48 minutes ago
    Looks very impressive especially considering the price and speed. Let's wait for AA to confirm how well their benchmarks hold up.
    • frail_figure 37 minutes ago
      Why not just try it yourself?
      • viraptor 31 minutes ago
        It costs money to run serious tests. We're way past the time when you could get an idea of the new model in a couple of tricky prompts. Now I need to compare a whole resulting project to get a clear view. If someone else proves the benchmarks don't hold up in reality, then it saves us further tests.
  • gmbhgmbh 48 minutes ago
    Thank you deepseek, we are eating good today.
  • risphere 30 minutes ago
    It's better than GLM 5.3 and Kimi K3 and way cheaper.
    • slopinthebag 28 minutes ago
      that's honestly insane. it's like the go-to for when you don't want to use opus 5.5/sol 6.1
      • ngl999 7 minutes ago
        The go-to is a local model.
  • nik736 58 minutes ago
    Those are crazy numbers for a Flash model. Hopefully they can scale what they are doing to 4.1 Pro.
  • npn 1 hour ago
    So this is the reason for the crash a few days ago.
    • dgellow 1 hour ago
      What crash?
      • npn 44 minutes ago
        Deepseek servers went unavailable for 5 hours. They compensated that by rewarding the previous week usage as credit though. Pretty nice.
      • brador 56 minutes ago
        Ai/tech stock crash
  • handfuloflight 1 hour ago
    Is it coming to OpenCode et al?
    • kzrdude 18 minutes ago
      Presumably. The current opencode slug for the model is just 'deepseek-flash' suggesting they will just update that one going forward, not keeping versions in parallel.
    • opengears 1 hour ago
      and do we know which version runs on opencode at the moment (on the free and on the paid version), is there a way to find out?
      • swiftcoder 5 minutes ago
        The only way I'm aware of is to check their twitter feed. They moved to Deepseek v4.1 flash in September
      • SublimePeace 33 minutes ago
        [dead]
  • throwfaraway135 1 hour ago
    Another big win for opensource AI.

    BTW who would have thought China would be the champion of freedom and opensource in the AI arena, while US is fighting for corporate/government control.

    • ngl999 10 minutes ago
      That's an image China wants the rest of the world to believe. Towards inside it still fits the typical stereotype.
    • Dah00n 29 minutes ago
      Well, at least mostly everyone outside the US.
    • ReptileMan 26 minutes ago
      Anyone that has observed China since the 90s.

      There are different types of freedom and China's bet is that as long as they provide enough economic freedom the public will be ok with somewhat restricted social and political one.

  • bashtoni 1 hour ago
    "a minor update" they say before showing off benchmarks that display a substantial improvement.
  • floooof 1 hour ago
    they must've been using this since 2-3 days when it became free again in OpenCode, it's noticeable smarter, beats GLM
  • freakynit 1 hour ago
    Those benchmarks can't possibly be real, right? Right? <insert padme 4-panel meme here>
    • logicchains 1 hour ago
      At this rate the frontier labs will be Anthropic and DeepSeek, with OpenAI struggling to keep up.
      • A_D_E_P_T 45 minutes ago
        OpenAI's models -- and even Google's Argon -- have particular niches where they shine. For GPT-6/6.1, it's 3D modeling; Astra is hands-down the best at making .step files, Blender files, etc. For Argon, it's natural language writing and everything that hooks up to Google, e.g. search and maps-based itinerary planning.

        Anthropic and DeepSeek (+ GLM) are definitely solving coding, though!

        They're all quite different tools.

        • Kurtz79 24 minutes ago
          Artificial Analysis recently released a dedicated 3D benchmark, where Astra lags behind both Opus and Sonnet 5.5 (and yes, open weight models seem to be quite far behind).

          https://artificialanalysis.ai/articles/aa-3d

          • A_D_E_P_T 2 minutes ago
            Interesting!

            For me it's large files in Blender (in some cases >400MB), mostly, where Astra excels. I gave it a look, but I don't know if the benchmark encompasses that sort of thing.

            .step files are simpler pieces of straightforward code, so it makes sense that Opus and Sonnet 5.5 do very well...

          • swiftcoder 2 minutes ago
            its unfortunate they didn't include deepseek in the initial batch of benchmarks
      • freakynit 1 hour ago
        I believe these are the last sets of super-high-end models available to public (open or closed).. these companies probably will now start to withhold top-of-the-line models for themselves, governments, and their super-high-paying partners only.
        • A_D_E_P_T 39 minutes ago
          That hasn't been the way to bet. DeepSeek and the other Chinese firms show no signs of slowing down, so if OAI and Anthropic halt releases and "pace the frontier" they'll just fall behind. (And there's a chance that high-end AI will become fully commoditized, which suits DeepSeek just fine.)

          Besides, Fable 5.5 is reportedly releasing within the next few days, probably on Tuesday...

        • stymaar 1 hour ago
          News from a near future:

          Here's How Distill APT Used McKinsey's Private Access To Top Anthropic Model To Help The Chinese Keep Up With The Us Top IA Labs Despite Access Restrictions

        • ReptileMan 50 minutes ago
          We have the weights, we have the papers, nothing preventing development on this foundation.
      • slopinthebag 55 minutes ago
        idk, sol 6.1 is both cheap and capable. i've been using it exclusively, i don't need to care about usage, and it's really smart.

        yes maybe opus 5.5 is stronger and flash is cheaper, but 6.1 strikes a good balance imo.

        • ReptileMan 52 minutes ago
          i have a feeling that Sol is just Astra low, but with lowest possible priority on the compute.
          • WASDx 30 minutes ago
            I believe it's Astra quantized. It was briefly named astra-lite.
  • SublimePeace 36 minutes ago
    [dead]
  • m00dy 1 hour ago
    We're in a crisis
  • ngl999 25 minutes ago
    Censored, no surprise